Discogram more painful than 3 lvl fusion?

[jsewell]

Real Army Wife,
I too had a discogram on multiple levels of my thoracic spine. I agree it was the worst pain ever. I was able to remain on the table but not without tears, wimpering, crying, and moaning. I had problems with a level in my thoracic spine which was no longer allowing me to stand very long or walk very long without needing to lay down . Even in the airport at the horror of my 4 kids. I too gave birth to 4 kids, have had a total hip replacement, lots of spine surgery with many complications, lung surgery etc. Still that was the worst pain EVER. I am not fused through different surgeries from C4 thru L4 and in 3 weeks will have surgery from T5 thru L5.
Nothing i have ever done or had done has compared to the sheer pain of that discography. So don't fear the surgery. It is painful to get out of bed after the surgery, the physical therapist will have you log roll and get up a certain way, but still think of the discography and you will know you can do anything. I always said nothing was as painful as childbirth until that.
At the time i rated T 6-7 a 20 out of 10. I underrated some of the other levels until it came to the other one which was really bad. I could not call the really bad levels a 10, had to be a 20!!.

I did have surgery to remove the disks at those levels. For a few months i still had the same pain and was thinking it was all for nothing, but believe me it all cleared up and i have not felt any of the pre surgery pain.
Don't worry and ask any questions you have
judy

[real_army_wife]

Thanks for your reply, Judy! I told the nurse that I now will have to rethink the 1-10 pain scale, since that was beyond excruciating. I know that I will NEVER have another one of those, no matter what!

Originally Posted by jsewell

Real Army Wife,
I too had a discogram on multiple levels of my thoracic spine. I agree it was the worst pain ever. I was able to remain on the table but not without tears, wimpering, crying, and moaning. I had problems with a level in my thoracic spine which was no longer allowing me to stand very long or walk very long without needing to lay down . Even in the airport at the horror of my 4 kids. I too gave birth to 4 kids, have had a total hip replacement, lots of spine surgery with many complications, lung surgery etc. Still that was the worst pain EVER. I am not fused through different surgeries from C4 thru L4 and in 3 weeks will have surgery from T5 thru L5.
Nothing i have ever done or had done has compared to the sheer pain of that discography. So don't fear the surgery. It is painful to get out of bed after the surgery, the physical therapist will have you log roll and get up a certain way, but still think of the discography and you will know you can do anything. I always said nothing was as painful as childbirth until that.
At the time i rated T 6-7 a 20 out of 10. I underrated some of the other levels until it came to the other one which was really bad. I could not call the really bad levels a 10, had to be a 20!!.

I did have surgery to remove the disks at those levels. For a few months i still had the same pain and was thinking it was all for nothing, but believe me it all cleared up and i have not felt any of the pre surgery pain.
Don't worry and ask any questions you have
judy

[Maria]

I've had 3 and they didn't hurt anymore than my back going out or flaring up terribly over the 20 years before I had the 1st discogram done! With the first one I learned that with the 2nd I asked for something to be given in the disc space to help with the pain afterwards so I was given Marcaine in the injected discs. The 3rd time I had an ESI (epidural steroid injection) done after the discogram so that was even less pain and longer duration of relief!

My discograms were 3 levels... re a 3 level fusion ~ were you checked out to see if at any levels you could have an artificial disc vs. fusion? At least you've had your children already so you won't be trying to get pregnant and go thru that having a baby/toddler to deal with after your recovery should you have a multi level fusion.

I was slated to have a 3 level global fusion in 2001 and decided against it waiting to see if I would be able to have artificial discs implanted instead and even tho I had multiple recommendations for at least 2 level ADR or hybrid surgery with ADR and fusion I didn't have any of it done as I felt better enough after many years of pain (like 20 plus) to not have more surgery (had 2 discectomies already w/2nd one failing terribly).

I think how you do post fusion is pretty individual and I would think the pain would be worst than the discogram in that it's prolonged while you recover and hopefully you will recover well however again I think that is very individual. I'd not try to rush recovery that's for sure as that could lead to more problems and more surgery sooner than later. Many people that have fusions seem to have to have more surgery/more fusions.

My last spine surgery was in '92. I hope to keep it that way tho I do have flare ups and I still have problems. I think tho I'd have more problems if I had had more surgery particularly fusion from what I see of persons having fusions.

However only you know how badly you're feeling and functioning. I don't use a cane tho I don't work any longer and I do take a low dose opioid pain med daily. I think it's a fair trade off however for how well I think I'm functioning most of the time spine wise.

Wishing you the best with whatever you do and please don't make your decision in haste.. really think it out and make it from a mental place that where you're thinking clearly and not feeling under the gun to make a decision if that's at all possible.

[real_army_wife]

Hi Maria,

I think a main issue was that both the sedative (versed) and pain killer (fentanyl) they injected did not work. They even tried 3 times. They also injected steroids, but that also was excruciating, so I screamed for him to stop. What were the findings of your discograms? Do you remember? Also, have you had surgery? Thanks for your reply!

Originally Posted by Maria

I've had 3 and they didn't hurt anymore than my back going out or flaring up terribly over the 20 years before I had the 1st discogram done! With the first one I learned that with the 2nd I asked for something to be given in the disc space to help with the pain afterwards so I was given Marcaine in the injected discs. The 3rd time I had an ESI (epidural steroid injection) done after the discogram so that was even less pain and longer duration of relief!

My discograms were 3 levels...

[real_army_wife]

Maria- disregard my questions!! Sorry! My phone only showed the 1st paragraph!

[real_army_wife]

Besides my bad discs, I have facet athropy (arthritis), DDD, spinal stenosis, and SI joint issues. From what my surgeon has said, a laminectomy is off of the table due to that. I will ask about artificial discs. Can you do that without a fusion? I've been deciding on surgery for over a year. Mainly because I needed it over the summer, due to my 3school age kids, and 4 year old. I'd have to stay with my mother who lives in a different town, because my husband works crazy hours. I know I don't want to wait another year. To function I take 2- 10/325 percocets a day; 1 zanaflex every 8, 1 mobic a day, 1 Valium at night. I also was on some cream, and lidocaine patches, but it caused eczema on my back. I just cannot function like this, but can't stand to live with the pain either. Thanks for your help!

[jsewell]

Real Army Wife,
I so agree with you regarding the pain of my very bad discs. However i had a 6 level discogram. as i mentioned i had 2 very very bad and painful like nothing my back ever caused levels. the other levels which all had tears and little problems hurt but not that bad compared to the super painful levels. I only gave them a 6 on the 1-10 pain scale. Probably would have scored higher if i had not had the excrutiating levels.
I also had a thoracic fusion first before the discogram which did nothing to stop my pain but was also very painful. Neither my doc nor i could figure out why it hurt me so bad . I lay in the hospital bed for days without moving in a crunched up ball until my surgeon came in several times a day and moved me up and straightened me out. A few months later it was discovered that i had an imflammatory muscle condition called polymyalgia rheumatica. So with my back muscles already inflammed (as were the rest of the muscles in my body) the cutting of the muscle sent me into horrible pain. Even though i softly cried constantly for days, it was not as bad as the pain from my discogram!!!
I have had some huge fusions, the first do to scoliosis and a quickly advancing kyphosis. It was affecting my lung function and i already had a 50% loss of lung function. I was almost on oxygen so I had to do the long fusion. But i don't really have any problems with it. I am much better off. I know most people on this site are for ADR's, as i said i was never a candidate. Another long fusion starting in the cervical area happened because i broke my neck. So that could not be avoided as well. So fused from C4 thru L4 has not been a problem . a little stiffness and only with the last level added did i have problems standing up straight. But it has been a year now since the last fusions and it is getting better , but it was not painful . Just a hard to explain uncomfortable feeling but it is also do to my curve being messed up and not having enough of a curve to my spine.

I think you will be fine, but do find out all you can about ADR and if you are a candidate maybe at your young age that is the thing for you to do. Do find out though
judy

[Maria]

Army Wife,
the biggest thing when wondering if you're a candidate for ADR is to make sure you see someone that does both ADR and fusion. A surgeon that mainly or only does fusions is going to tell you that you're not a candidate or put this type of surgery down.. even if you might be a candidate.

My findings were an anular tear at L3 which I've had forever, bulging disc at L4 (had surgery on it and it rebulged) and worse disc was L5S1 with bulging and so forth even tho I also had surgery on this disc (discectomy). Also DDD worse L3-L5S1, scar tissue on the rt.S1 nerve root and so forth, so on.

I've developed facet arthropathy too and have SI joint probs in the past and just about every rotten symptom possible in lumbar area then finally after many years living with really debilitating chronic pain my L5S1 area auto fused and that has given me an incredible amount of relief! Not that I don't still have pain because I do with L4 still but I cannot see having more surgery and taking the time out for recovery and not knowing whether I'll function any better than I do or whatever... and probably setting myself up for more surgery.

I'm 58 and if I can keep going like I am hopefully if I do have to have another surgery it will just be one more because of how long I'm waiting!

However you sound fairly young and active still with kids and such so you have to do what you have to do in order to try and regain your life~ that's understandable.

Before you go see anyone else just make sure to find out if they even do ADR if you might possibly be a candidate even at one level. I was offered a hybrid surgery with ADR at L4 and fusion at L5S1 but I don't like the idea of fusions and the screws. Mostly the screws. Plus I was just worried about being worse off and adjacent segment syndrome (fusion putting more pressure on discs above or below to perform) tho not sure if this doesn't happen with ADR too.

Good luck! It's a difficult position to be in re researching surgery and what to do tho hopefully you'll make the best "informed" decision.