Swollen ankles and feet

symara · #1 (**permalink**) 05-08-2009, 11:57 AM

My feet and ankles started hurting about a week ago, felt sore and hurt after sitting for a bit when I got up to walk around. Now the last couple of days, they are swelling to the point I have no ankles what-so-ever. I go to the surgeon Monday, but was wondering if anyone else has had this????

I can't do a search for some reason, the feature isn't working for me.

My MRI came back this past Monday saying my disc was "protruding" and "impinging" on my exiting nerve root.

symara · #2 (**permalink**) 05-08-2009, 01:21 PM

just an fyi, I finally talked to a nurse that works here with me and she said that it's definately being caused by the nerve root having pressure on it by my disc.

dshobbies · #3 (**permalink**) 05-08-2009, 06:56 PM

Hi Symara,

I don't think I've said welcome yet, so welcome to the forum. Glad you found us but sorry you need to be here.

I too have foot and ankle swelling. I always thought it was my mother's bad genes but on bad days, it's definitely worse. Never heard anyone else complain about it either so maybe, at least for me, it is my mother's bad genes

.

Dale

symara · #4 (**permalink**) 05-08-2009, 07:11 PM

well, I'll find out more about it Monday when I talk to the Dr and let everyone know for sure.

jchebert1979 · #5 (**permalink**) 05-08-2009, 08:01 PM

I don't suffer from swelling but in my research I have found some info. If I remember correctly, part of you sympathetic nervous system is controlled from ganglia in the cervical, thoracic, and lumbar areas. Any of these can be damaged and cause swelling, color changes, and sensory changes. The best you will probably get from a doctor though is it's possible but very unlikely. I can't tell you how many times I have heard that.

mmglobal · #6 (**permalink**) 05-09-2009, 02:30 AM

I know post-op patients who get edema; especially on long flights or if they sit all day at work, etc.. My wife, Diane, still gets this occasionally. I think that there are many other reasons separate from spine problems that cause many of us to get this as we age. I've seen several people with a sympathetic disorder that have many of the symptoms you mention, but have never heard of swollen ankles in the absence of the other symptoms being attributed to a sympathetic problem. (**** but I may be completely wrong!!!! The fact that I have'nt seen it doesn't mean much... I'm just sharing my experience.)

treefrog · #7 (**permalink**) 05-09-2009, 09:48 PM

Last night I noticed my feet, ankles and possibly a little up the calf is swollen. In my case, I think it might be from naproxen, which I just started taking Monday.

I stopped taking it as of this morning. And I will call my rheumatologist on Monday (she's the one who prescribed it). I would have had to stop taking it a week from surgery, which would be about a little more than a week from now. So, I'm just stopping a little sooner.

I'll have to try and sort these other issues out, after the surgery. That is, if they continue after surgery. I admit I am hoping that some of these strange issues will go away after surgery.

treefrog · #8 (**permalink**) 05-10-2009, 06:45 PM

Well, the swelling in my feet is gone now. I will see what my doc thinks, if she agrees it was caused by the naproxen.

Maria · #9 (**permalink**) 05-10-2009, 08:22 PM

Please let us know what your doctor says tomorrow..

Last Sept I started having bilateral severe ankle pain that traveled up my calves and to my knees.. the ankles were bilaterally swollen tho minimally. The pain was excrutiating...

Being a long time lumbar spine patient I thought "this has got to be related to my spine".. and I waited it out nearly a month before going to the doctor only to find I had something known as "posterior tibeal tendonitis" bilaterally.

It was the bilateral aspect of the foot problem that had thrown me off plus the fact I've had knee and leg pain before attributed to my lumbar disc probs and even some foot pain.

So even tho what you are reporting could very well be related to your spinal problems and/or medications or something of that nature it's always best to rule out any medical problem that could be occuring.

Good luck and I hope it will easily remedied.

runner · #10 (**permalink**) 05-11-2009, 12:16 AM

I had swollen feet (they were big!!!) after I gave birth to my son and was at home so i called the doctor and the doctor on call insisted I go to the ER.
The reason is that after pregnancy you can have a deep vein thrombosis (DVT or blood clot) in a leg and that can cause swelling. So I went to the ER to get checked out.
They did an ultrasound to check for a clot and I was clear.

DVT can happen when people travel on airplanes and don't get up and move around and it can happen after spinal surgery, too.
And it happens to people on bedrest or ones that are not moving around much like people in pain who are lying down a lot.
The problem with DVT is that it can lead to a pulmonary embolus and this is a
serious problem that can kill. This is because the clot in the vein will travel to the lungs.

So anytime you have swollen feet it should be checked out if you have just had spine surgery or you have been immobile.
Usually if you have a DVT, you will have swelling in one leg or calf and the area will also be painful.
CindyLou on here had a pulmonary embolism so she can tell you about what happened.
So IMHO, I think any unusual swelling of the feet should be checked out by a doctor. I understand, we do have swelling of the feet sometimes with travel or if it is unusually warm, that is different.
Swelling of the feet can also be due to a cardiac problem.

Being a spine patient, I would just have any unusual symptom checked out by your doctor.
That is my two cents on this topic.
I don't want to scare anybody but this is a possibility, especially after spinal surgery.

Maria · #11 (**permalink**) 05-11-2009, 02:05 AM

Any gross swelling of extremities would definately have me at my doctor's or in an Urgent Care or ER... there are just too many possibilities and it's better err on the safe side

symara · #12 (**permalink**) 05-11-2009, 06:15 PM

I went and told him about the pain and swelling, he just wrote it off like it was just another symptom of my back... nothing new... wants to do another discectemy in 2-3 weeks.

the swelling was less over the weekend, I think it may be worse as I sit down for longer periods. we'll see today now that i'm back at work.

Maria · #13 (**permalink**) 05-11-2009, 08:42 PM

It could be dependent edema (dependent on position/extremities positioned below heart level, weight bearing/ crossed and sitting, dangling) and perhaps there is a different reason (medical vs. spinal) so I think you should make your Primary Medical Care doctor aware of this occurence should it indicate anything that medically needs to be checked out further.

I realize of course prior to a discectomy you will be getting a physical to clear you for surgery so if there is a problem of a medical nature it could show up then ~ if there is one...

Pedal edema doesn't usually just happen for no reason altho sometimes as women age and go thru hormonal changes that can explain it but there are other things to consider and make certain are ok such as cardiac,circulatory,vascular, renal, and lymphatic systems functioning.

Will you be getting a 2nd surgical opinion re the discectomy?

dshobbies · #14 (**permalink**) 05-11-2009, 11:19 PM

Symara,
Any surgery is your decision. But what your doctor is not telling you is that the likelihood of failure for yet another discectomy. I've had two and know this is not an easy surgery onto itself and though I do think I would have agreed to the first, knowing what I know now, I would not have agreed to the second one. I did refuse a third surgery which ultimately led to my 3 level ADR.

Also, after a discectomy, your disc is compromised and can no longer support its full function. This causes increased pressure on adjacent discs which often leads to degeneration at those levels, which can lead to degeneration at their adjacent segments.

Before agreeing to another discectomy, please discuss this with your doctor. The statistics are not in your favor.

Whatever your decision, I wish you good luck, Dale

Maria · #15 (**permalink**) 05-12-2009, 02:39 AM

I too strongly recommend getting more than one surgical opinion when it comes to 2nd discectomy. My first one was successful at L5S1 but my 2nd one at L4 was not and then I ended up having probs with recurrent disc bulges at both levels, scar tissue, hastening DDD and future spinal problems.

That being said it could be that wouldn't be your case and you may need *something* done surgically however I'd just want to have more than one opinion and for myself more than 2. But usually most surgeons recommend getting a 2nd surgical opinion at least.

symara · #16 (**permalink**) 05-12-2009, 03:00 PM

I am trying to get at least one more opinion. Unfortunately, the only dr that was doing ADR in this area is not longer doing it since the hospital will not do it now, since insurance will not pay for it. He won't even consult with me. I won't see him for a regular surgical opinion if ADR isn't an option since he isn't in Network. I'm going to call the prodisc people and see if anyone has been at least trained in this area. Maybe I can get into see someone that at least has been trained and get their honest opinion.

I also e-mailed Dr Balderston to see if I could get a long-distance consult with him, so we'll see. I have a lot of phone calls to make it seems.

kc0iet · #17 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 06:41 AM

I too have had a "new symptom" of bilateral swelling in both feet and legs.

I have had the problem with my right leg, but not to this extent, and not both feet and legs. I told my GP and she shrugged it off. At my insistence she did do some blood work and wrote me a script for Dyazidine. That was almost a month ago. Some days it is worse than others, but I haven't seen my ankles since! The pain is relentless.

I don't think it is hormones, I had a complete hysterectomy twenty years ago, and I hope it is not age; I am 44. Since the appointment with my GP I also saw an ortho surgeon who blew me and all of my symptoms off completely, but that is another thread completely! I have another appointment with my GP Monday, but I am not holding my breath.

Quote:

Originally Posted by symara

My feet and ankles started hurting about a week ago, felt sore and hurt after sitting for a bit when I got up to walk around. Now the last couple of days, they are swelling to the point I have no ankles what-so-ever. I go to the surgeon Monday, but was wondering if anyone else has had this????

I can't do a search for some reason, the feature isn't working for me.

My MRI came back this past Monday saying my disc was "protruding" and "impinging" on my exiting nerve root.

jessmith07 · #18 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 12:16 PM

Symara, what meds are you currently taking? Could it be that you've added something new recently (or changed dosage of existing meds or even changed to a generic) and that you might be taking two or more things that are causing a reaction with each other? Do you have different docs prescribing different meds that you may be filling at different pharmacies, and because of this, no one has caught on to what is happening? I've been down this road with my mother-in-law, and if I hadn't asked all these questions of her, and caught what was happening, she would have been in a coma within 24 hours...

Also, I completely agree with Dale about having another discectomy...and if I'm reading your signature correctly, this would be your 3rd one on the same disc in 5 years? Seems to me that there'd be a lot of scar tissue build-up by doing that many...and then if you do decide to do ADR in the future, could all this scar tissue prevent you from being a candidate?

If you can't find a doctor in your area that does ADR and that's the way you want to go then you may have to travel. And if you have to travel, then you may as well travel to the best. Experience in placing these implants is critical to the success of the surgery. There are many people on this forum who can help you find a good doctor or you can go to Mark...just send a PM to mmglobal and he can help you.

Hang in there...we're here for you...keep us posted. One more thought...have you tried elevating your legs in the evenings?

Jess

symara · #19 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessmith07

Symara, what meds are you currently taking? Could it be that you've added something new recently (or changed dosage of existing meds or even changed to a generic) and that you might be taking two or more things that are causing a reaction with each other? Do you have different docs prescribing different meds that you may be filling at different pharmacies, and because of this, no one has caught on to what is happening? I've been down this road with my mother-in-law, and if I hadn't asked all these questions of her, and caught what was happening, she would have been in a coma within 24 hours...

Also, I completely agree with Dale about having another discectomy...and if I'm reading your signature correctly, this would be your 3rd one on the same disc in 5 years? Seems to me that there'd be a lot of scar tissue build-up by doing that many...and then if you do decide to do ADR in the future, could all this scar tissue prevent you from being a candidate?

If you can't find a doctor in your area that does ADR and that's the way you want to go then you may have to travel. And if you have to travel, then you may as well travel to the best. Experience in placing these implants is critical to the success of the surgery. There are many people on this forum who can help you find a good doctor or you can go to Mark...just send a PM to mmglobal and he can help you.

Hang in there...we're here for you...keep us posted. One more thought...have you tried elevating your legs in the evenings?

Jess

I'm taking Hydrocodone with phenegren for pain and nausea with the meds, taking for awhile so I don't think that's it. I started Topamax a few weeks ago, but i can't find that as a side affect anywhere. I started Cymbalta a few days ago, but that was after all this started. I get this all filled at the same pharmacy.

Yes, this is my third discectomy, if I do it. I have one appointment with an orthopedic surgeon for a second opinion, getting another in june after I get my surgical notes from the previous surgeries faxed over to them. I have a call in to the professor of orthopedic surgery at UofK in Lexington, should be getting a priority consult from them anytime now, it will probably be July before I can be seen though. I'm calling Dr Balderston's office today about an e-mail I sent to see if I can do a phone appointment with him.

as far as elevating, I've been putting them up, probably not above my heart like I should, but it hasn't been as bad that the last couple days, not gone, but not ballooned up like hobbitt feet.

jessmith07 · #20 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:13 PM

This may be your problem...looks like the two together could be causing fluid retention. I take Topamax too, to prevent migraines, and it also helped me with nerve pain...

You searched for interactions between:
topamax (topiramate)
Phenergan (promethazine)
Interaction(s) found:

promethazine and topiramate (Major Drug-Drug)

MONITOR CLOSELY: Certain drugs such as carbonic anhydrase inhibitors and drugs with anticholinergic activity (e.g., antihistamines, antispasmodics, neuroleptics, phenothiazines, skeletal muscle relaxants, tricyclic antidepressants, disopyramide) may potentiate the risk of oligohidrosis and hyperthermia associated occasionally with the use of topiramate, particularly in pediatric patients. These agents may alter electrolyte and fluid balance (carbonic anhydrase inhibition), inhibit peripheral sweating mechanisms (anticholinergic effect), and/or interfere with core body temperature regulation in the hypothalamus (neuroleptics and phenothiazines), resulting in the inability to adjust to temperature changes, especially in hot weather. Also, agents with anticholinergic activity frequently cause drowsiness and other central nervous system-depressant effects, which may be additively or synergistically increased in patients also treated with topiramate.

symara · #21 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:27 PM

Just so I make sure I'm reading it right, it's the two together that's probably causing it???

That's why I couldn't find anything on the topamax before, because I was just looking at it by itself. The weird thing is, I was taking it before and after my last surgery along with everything else (exept the cymbalta) and didn't have this. They say your body goes through a complete cellular change every 10 years or something though and you can react differently though, so maybe that's it.

Right now, it's not bad, so I'm going to see if it goes away, maybe it's just one of those side affects that goes away after a bit. If it starts to get bad again I'll contact my primary care physician to see if he can give me something else instead of the topamax.

BTW, the person the recomended Mark, do you know if he could find out if a 3rd Discectomy would remove me from being a candidate for ADR in the future?

jessmith07 · #22 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:30 PM

Also, Topamax does take a while to build up in your system, so it's not surprising that it took a while for these symptoms to appear, if this really is what's going on. I do know, from my research before beginning Topamax, that this is a pretty heavy-duty drug and should be monitored very closely with other things that you take. Do you take the Phenergan every time you take the pain meds? I know that in the beginning, you can be sensitive to certain things, but build up a tolerance over time. Have you tried the pain meds without the Phenergan? Or take all this info to your doctor and ask if you can take a "water pill"...just a thought...

jessmith07 · #23 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:33 PM

One more thought...could the fluid retention that you might be experiencing from these two drugs be exacerbated by your cycle?

symara · #24 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:39 PM

no, I'm not due to start for another week or so

symara · #25 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessmith07

Also, Topamax does take a while to build up in your system, so it's not surprising that it took a while for these symptoms to appear, if this really is what's going on. I do know, from my research before beginning Topamax, that this is a pretty heavy-duty drug and should be monitored very closely with other things that you take. Do you take the Phenergan every time you take the pain meds? I know that in the beginning, you can be sensitive to certain things, but build up a tolerance over time. Have you tried the pain meds without the Phenergan? Or take all this info to your doctor and ask if you can take a "water pill"...just a thought...

sorry, didn't see this post.

I try occasionally to take a pain pill without the phenegran when I'm low on the phengren, but i still get pretty ill, unless I've gorged myself on food before taking it, but then of course the pain pill doesn't work as well either. I take half a phenegren when I take a whole pain pill, or a quarter with a half pain pill. when I first got them I was taking a whole phenegren and it was knocking me out (2 years ago).

Will they give you a water pill for swelling just for feet and ankles? I know nothing about water pills except that my grandmother took them.

jessmith07 · #26 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 02:47 PM

You can get them over-the-counter at the drug store, I would just make sure that your doctor or pharmacist says it's safe. The brand that I have used is called Aqua-Ban...it's a little blue pill.

runner · #27 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 03:16 PM

Symara,

"Water pills" are diuretics. Meaning they flush water out of your system. I would not recommend taking them without the advice of your physician. I swelled up a little bit when i started Gabapentin (neurotin) (the anti-seizure medicine used for nerve pain) but it decreased a bit with time.
On the side effect listing on Gabapentin, fluid retention is one side effect.

Runner

treefrog · #28 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 04:09 PM

And just remember that side effects can start at any time, even if you have been taking a drug for a while. But, Jess has given you some good advice, and found some good information.

I guess you talked to your doctor about the swelling? Did you talk about possible drug interactions, or side effects? Sometimes all the possible side effects are not listed, and of course everyone is different.

dshobbies · #29 (**permalink**) 05-13-2009, 05:39 PM

FYI,

Lemon is a natural diruretic. Do not use before going to bed

symara · #30 (**permalink**) 06-01-2009, 02:33 PM

i'm off the phenegran!!!!

we'll here's what happened...

went to my primary care doctor, had a bad time with all pain management doctors here recently and don't have one right now. they are putting some new ones in at the hospital and my primary care doctor is waiting for them to go in there to send me to them, he say they should be doing long term.

so her put me on the fentanyl patch, which I do not need the phenegran for since it doesn't make me ill. he did go ahead and give me a water pill though to be safe on the swelling. so I am now fairly pain free thanks to the patch, sleeping better thanks to the patch, and not sleepy durring the day since I'm not on phenegran, and no pain in the feet or swelling.

i just have to remember that this is just covering up my symptoms and i'm not better. I almost feel normal, but I have to remember I'm not.

dshobbies · #31 (**permalink**) 06-01-2009, 04:42 PM

Symara,

Great that you're feeling better and you're right, it's only a pain fix, not a fix. It's kind of a catch 22. Why do anything if you're feeling good but in order to feel good, meds are a part of your daily life, and there's always the risk of further injury, etc. I'm sure you're mind is whirling with all these thoughts but at least you can think much more clearly.

Keep us posted, Dale

mmglobal · #32 (**permalink**) 06-01-2009, 05:56 PM

drink lots of water... keep your bowels moving. The fentanyl can really clog things up. It's nice that you have a GP who will take care of you until you get with a PM who will provide appropriate care.

Mark

nomorepain · #33 (**permalink**) 06-05-2009, 06:49 PM

within 24 hours of my prodisc surgery i had an issue with swelling, was rushed into a CT Scan to make sure the new prodiscs were not impinging on my nerve canal, they weren't...but to this day when i am on my feet a long time, or it's hot, or it's just time for them to swell, it happens, no reason as far as i can tell, and i have had every test in the book for this issue. On occasion i wear compression stockings, you can get them at any good medical device store, they are spendy at about $40.00/pr, and are offered in a few different compression percentages, well worth the investment, but have a doctor tell you what compression you need, these are great stockings that are either knee high or up to the hip. keeps everything under control...hope this helps you.

nomorepain · #34 (**permalink**) 09-04-2009, 06:47 PM

I have feet& ankle swellling also, been more of an issue after my prodisc surgery, in fact i was rushed into a CT scan following my surgery due to swelling, but everything appeared normal at that time. i notice it most when i am on my feet all day, and it's hot. So my regular Doc introduced me to compression stockings, they can be had at any good health supply company, consult your doc as to the best compression ratings for you, they come in knee-highs and are worn under socks. They definetly help keep the swelling in check and down, and what a relief when you take them off at night. I'm told the swelling is an age issue, but i refuse to grow up! it's my body that won't keep up,hmmmmmmm